Moderators From United States, joined Apr 2004, 140 posts, RR: 1 Posted (3 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3756 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW FORUM MODERATOR
Users have requested that we bring some organization to the large number of posts being made about the 2008 U.S. Presidential Election in the non-aviation forum. For this reason, we’re creating ‘official’ threads to provide some structure to the overall subject, and make it easier for readers to contribute and follow the various discussions.
Six threads are being created, including this one. If you want to add a post, please make sure you’re adding it to the most appropriate of the choices shown below:
Official U.S. Election – McCain/Palin Campaign (this thread)
Official U.S. Election – Obama/Biden Campaign
Official U.S. Election – McCain/Palin Plans & Policies
Official U.S. Election – Obama/Biden Plans & Policies
Official U.S. Election – Polls & Projections
Official U.S. Election – Humor, Commentary, Etc.
MD80fanatic From United States, joined Apr 2004, 2335 posts, RR: 11 Reply 1, posted (3 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3734 times:
Quote: Just guessing, but I bet you don't care too much for George W. Bush. He would in fact have completely topped your list there.
George W got a BA from Yale and an MBA from Harvard. He is the only president to have an MBA under his belt.
Go figure....
Good call MOBflyer, so what is the real worth of everyone's degree again? Unless he's faking it....I'd say most people could rise to the same level or higher.
MOBflyer From United States, joined Sep 2007, 935 posts, RR: 4 Reply 2, posted (3 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 3713 times:
Quoting MD80fanatic (Reply 1): Good call MOBflyer, so what is the real worth of everyone's degree again? Unless he's faking it....I'd say most people could rise to the same level or higher.
Now I actually like Bush, but I just wanted to make that point. Also, someone said that a JD/PhD, etc topped a MA. For most cases that is indeed true. Most, however, consider the MBA, especially an Ivy League MBA, as the terminal business degree.
Blackbird From United States, joined Oct 1999, 3436 posts, RR: 5 Reply 3, posted (3 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 3710 times:
There are many qualities that make a good leader, intelligence is just one of those qualities...
Just because you're educated does not necessarily make a person a good person, or a good leader. You can be intellectually brilliant, have multiple PhD's, and still be a psychopath... (No, I'm not saying Bush is a psychopath -- he actually does not fit the bill although he would probably fit the bill for an Antisocial Personality*)
Blackbird
* - Contrary to many people stating otherwise, Anti-Social Personality Disorder and Psychopathy are not exactly the same and it is possible to have Anti-Social Personality Disorder and not be a Psychopath.
LTBEWR From United States, joined Jan 2004, 8576 posts, RR: 16 Reply 4, posted (3 months 1 week 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3699 times:
Modern times require our top leaders not just to be well educated but also intellectually curious.
While well educated and from top universities, the seeming lack of intellectual curiosity is a major criticism of President Bush. He seems to have a narrow view of the world, fails to be open minded, bearly reads newspapers and rarely speaks to persons outside of the narrow 'neoconservative' beliefs world. This also seems to be an issue with Ms. Palin, well proven in her interviews with Couric.
McCain may be a bit better as to intellectual curosity and a bit more open minded, but still he continues narrow views as to international policy and has self-admitted to not being well versed on economic issues.
In comparison in the opinions of many, both Obama and Biden seem to be far more open minded, curious, thinking of ways to deal with issues than Bush, McCain and Palin. In Obama choosing Biden as his running mate, he sought someone to balance his weaknesses as to international issues and not having a pure 'yes man', with some clear differences on some issues.
MD80fanatic From United States, joined Apr 2004, 2335 posts, RR: 11 Reply 5, posted (3 months 1 week 2 days ago) and read 3687 times:
Some of the most evil dictators in the world were well educated. High intelligence requires high morals. I don't think intelligence and education are as important as having an honest character. Facts and figures can be learned as they go.....
Dreadnought From United States, joined Feb 2008, 685 posts, RR: 0 Reply 6, posted (3 months 1 week 2 days ago) and read 3683 times:
Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 4): In comparison in the opinions of many, both Obama and Biden seem to be far more open minded, curious, thinking of ways to deal with issues than Bush, McCain and Palin.
Hardly. I see Biden and Obama as ideologues, unable to accept the truth even as it bites them in the ass. Palin, it's too early to tell, although her reputation as mayor and governor is that of a realist. McCain (though I disagree with him on some issues), seems to be the most well-grounded of the bunch and does not see the world through shades of ideology.
You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. - Winston Churchill
AirCop From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 7, posted (3 months 1 week 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 3677 times:
Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 6): McCain (though I disagree with him on some issues), seems to be the most well-grounded of the bunch and does not see the world through shades of ideology.
Judging from his performance last week, McCain seems to be living in the past, how many times did he mention Ronald Reagan, who left office nearly twenty years ago. I really can't figure out why you would claim that McCain is well-grounded, his positions on issues during his campaign changes so fast, it often the opinion of the last person that he talked to on his cell phone. (There has been numerous articles about this in various national media). Personally the selection of Palin was McCain giving the American media and the American people the middle finger salute. (Of course, Palin is popular in Alaska, anyone would if they increased the oil check).
Dreadnought From United States, joined Feb 2008, 685 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (3 months 1 week 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 3668 times:
Quoting AirCop (Reply 7): Judging from his performance last week, McCain seems to be living in the past, how many times did he mention Ronald Reagan, who left office nearly twenty years ago.
You seem to be under the impression that we are in a new world where the old rules, wisdom and lessons don't apply anymore. this is the same sort of head-in-the-sand idealism that produced such falacies in the past as "The War to end all wars", "Peace in our time", or "These two entities—Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac—are not facing any kind of financial crisis" (The last one was Barney Frank a few years ago).
Quoting AirCop (Reply 7): I really can't figure out why you would claim that McCain is well-grounded, his positions on issues during his campaign changes so fast, it often the opinion of the last person that he talked to on his cell phone.
he has a disturbing habit of reverting to populist rhetoric that has me throwing stuff at the TV whenever I see him do that. But he has a record in Congress where we know his core beliefs. He is a moderate Republican/mild conservative, whatever his campaign rhetoric. Talk is cheap, and campaign stump speeches even more so. What counts is how you vote, where you take your stand when the chips are down.
And, sorry, once you are in the Oval Office, voting 'present' is no longer an option.
You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. - Winston Churchill
AirCop From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 10, posted (3 months 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3648 times:
Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 8): You seem to be under the impression that we are in a new world where the old rules, wisdom and lessons don't apply anymore.
Quite the opposite, we have learned that financial institutions are incapable of self regulation, and need some sort of government oversight, which is the opposite of the RR ideas that all regulation is bad.
Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 8): And, sorry, once you are in the Oval Office, voting 'present' is no longer an option.
Or being MIA..as some one who is unpopular with his fellow party members in the Senate, I just can't see a McCain administration getting support from the GOP for radical changes that are need for programs McCain supports such as global warming issues.
Dreadnought From United States, joined Feb 2008, 685 posts, RR: 0 Reply 11, posted (3 months 1 week 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 3645 times:
Quoting AirCop (Reply 10): Quite the opposite, we have learned that financial institutions are incapable of self regulation, and need some sort of government oversight, which is the opposite of the RR ideas that all regulation is bad.
If that's what you learned, you have not been paying attention. All roads lead to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. If government had not interferred in the free market via those two institutions, and arm-twisted the mortgage industry into selling mortgages that no banker in his right mind would sell, and on top of that allowed the GSEs to operate at ridiculous leverage rates, and finally, allowed them to become politically active, none of this would have happened.
Quoting AirCop (Reply 10): Or being MIA..as some one who is unpopular with his fellow party members in the Senate, I just can't see a McCain administration getting support from the GOP for radical changes that are need for programs McCain supports such as global warming issues.
Global Warming programs do not need to be radical.
You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. - Winston Churchill
BlueElephant From United States, joined Dec 2006, 984 posts, RR: 3 Reply 12, posted (3 months 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3630 times:
I'm sorry to those people who still feel that Sarah Palin is Competent...if she is...she's really gotta be allowed to show it...because right now she doesn't seem like it...
I'll give you a hit at what she does sound like....
BlueElephant: Hey Sarah....what newspapers do you read.
Sarah Palin: All of them.
BE: oh yah?...like which ones
SP: like...all of them
BE: cool...you play golf?...whats your golf score
SP: 18.
BE: you mean like 18 on a hole?
SP: No...Actually I get a hole in one on every hole...
11Bravo From United States, joined Feb 2005, 1494 posts, RR: 28 Reply 13, posted (3 months 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3621 times:
Quoting MD80fanatic (Reply 5): I don't think intelligence and education are as important as having an honest character. Facts and figures can be learned as they go.....
I don't think that particular model of decision making has served us very well in the last eight years. What you're describing here is exactly the sort of thing that has lead Bush into some deeply flawed decisions; act first, based on moral certainty and intuition, then consider the "facts and figures" that support your position. The problem, of course, with that mode of thinking is that you are much less likely to consider things that do not support your conclusion.
Maybe it's just me, but perhaps it would be refreshing to switch that around a bit and have decisions based on an analysis of the "facts and figures". To do that requires that you actually know something about those "facts and figures" before you start making your plan, and that, in turn, makes high-quality education a pre-requsite to that well considered judgement.
EA772LR From United States, joined Mar 2007, 1118 posts, RR: 0 Reply 14, posted (3 months 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3620 times:
Quoting BlueElephant (Reply 12):
BlueElephant: Hey Sarah....what newspapers do you read.
Sarah Palin: All of them.
BE: oh yah?...like which ones
SP: like...all of them
BE: cool...you play golf?...whats your golf score
SP: 18.
BE: you mean like 18 on a hole?
SP: No...Actually I get a hole in one on every hole...
Is this some trumped up interview you typed
Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 8): Quoting AirCop (Reply 7):
Judging from his performance last week, McCain seems to be living in the past, how many times did he mention Ronald Reagan, who left office nearly twenty years ago.
You seem to be under the impression that we are in a new world where the old rules, wisdom and lessons don't apply anymore. this is the same sort of head-in-the-sand idealism that produced such falacies in the past as "The War to end all wars", "Peace in our time", or "These two entities—Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac—are not facing any kind of financial crisis" (The last one was Barney Frank a few years ago).
If you always do what you've always done, then you'll always be what you've always been!
Baroque From Australia, joined Apr 2006, 8214 posts, RR: 29 Reply 15, posted (3 months 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3618 times:
Quoting MOBflyer (Reply 2): Now I actually like Bush, but I just wanted to make that point. Also, someone said that a JD/PhD, etc topped a MA. For most cases that is indeed true. Most, however, consider the MBA, especially an Ivy League MBA, as the terminal business degree.
And I guess the current crisis is his practical exam. Any MBAs on here who would care to mark him so far?
Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 4): While well educated and from top universities, the seeming lack of intellectual curiosity is a major criticism of President Bush. He seems to have a narrow view of the world, fails to be open minded, bearly reads newspapers and rarely speaks to persons outside of the narrow 'neoconservative' beliefs world. This also seems to be an issue with Ms. Palin, well proven in her interviews with Couric.
McCain may be a bit better as to intellectual curosity and a bit more open minded, but still he continues narrow views as to international policy and has self-admitted to not being well versed on economic issues.
Palin - NC McCain, again agree. I don't know his record well enough, and maybe it is my imagination but he seems to be coming over as more and more fixed in his ways. Possibly as the GOP goons put him in their straightjacket. He is almost getting to appear like an exhibit from (or in) Madame Tussauds. A puzzle.
MD80fanatic From United States, joined Apr 2004, 2335 posts, RR: 11 Reply 17, posted (3 months 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3608 times:
Quoting 11Bravo (Reply 13): I don't think that particular model of decision making has served us very well in the last eight years.
I would never assume Bush to have an honest character, I mean he was governor of the state that I live in. We knew him well before the rest of the country. What we need is a commander-in-chief form of a Mother Theresa. Tough and honest above all else.
So Bush is not the best example of this type of leadership, IMO.
I am afraid of a really brilliant person being given such lofty power over the course of this country....especially when the citizenry are afraid to protest, and instead choose to voice dissent by blowing off steam to their friends via cellphone....rather than getting in the face of elected officials - regardless of the cost. Power corrupts, and the presidency is a tool a highly educated person with skewed priorities can use to destroy the world.
StuckInCA From United States, joined Oct 2005, 1145 posts, RR: 1 Reply 18, posted (3 months 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3602 times:
Quoting MD80fanatic (Reply 17): Power corrupts, and the presidency is a tool a highly educated person with skewed priorities can use to destroy the world.
Power corrupts, and the presidency is a tool an uneducated person with skewed priorities can use to destroy the world.
Power corrupts, and the presidency is a tool a closed minded zealot with skewed priorities can use to destroy the world.
Power corrupts, and the presidency is a tool a power drunk neo-con with rich oil men at his side can use to destroy the world.
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